Author Topic: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners  (Read 758 times)

Offline Thomasmagnum

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #15 on: 03 February 2012, 21:27:47 »
Thanks Tigg, I like to hear things like that. We try awful hard with our kids to really instill them how fun, challenging, and rewarding shooting can be... while also showing how seriously safe gun handling needs to be taken.
Kimberly another great resource for teaching kids gun safety is the NRA's Eddie the Eagle program. Even if you are not a member of the NRA you can still contact them and receive some free materials regarding the program. It really is quite excellent, and kids react very well to it.

If you and Carl would like to go shooting sometime just to get feel for what its like or try a couple of different guns I would be happy to help out. I am sure Chris would be willing as well. I did similar for Tigg awhile back. In fact with a little coaching I had her and another lady hitting a target at 100 yards regularly with a handgun.
« Last Edit: 04 February 2012, 22:17:44 by Thomasmagnum »
To a liberal, a right is what others owe you.
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Offline Thomasmagnum

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #16 on: 03 February 2012, 21:36:55 »
Ah I see Chris posted while I was pecking away on my phone to post... :D
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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #17 on: 03 February 2012, 21:56:09 »
The other lady was the infamous Mac2 aka Poli.

Tigg warms my heart as well
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Offline Pet Social Worker

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #18 on: 05 February 2012, 16:28:11 »
Ok, well reading these replies just gives me more questions but I'm so so appreciative of all of the comments

Having Nate in the house is my main reason for NOT owning a gun but also FOR owning one...does that make sense? 

I would see the gun as "protection" but if I have to keep the ammo separate from the gun and then in a locked safe, would it be readily available if needed?   Macrojamin - how quickly do you think you can get into your safe by the bed if someone was breaking in your bedroom window? 

If an intruder breaks into my house and I shoot him dead.....do I go to jail? 
Kimberly Diedrich

Offline the.pixie.stick.chick

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #19 on: 05 February 2012, 16:51:41 »
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cw4B_XbW7ds[/youtube]

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Offline Desert Dweller

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #20 on: 05 February 2012, 17:13:45 »
A gun is only protection if you know how to use it.  Otherwise, it's a dangerous weapon that will most likely end up in the hands of whoever is coming after you.  Having distance between you and your target is what keeps you safe.  Also, knowing in you're mind the absolute answer to the question, "Am I okay to shoot?" is as essential as knowing how to use the weapon.  If you hesitate for a second to try to figure out if you're justified to shoot, that may be the second that the intruder needs to get to you. 

I think the CCW classes are good for anyone who is thinking of keeping a weapon - concealed or not.  You get the shoot/don't shoot info and you also learn what it's like to handle a firearm.  Some people go through the classes and decided that gun ownership isn't for them.  That's an informed decision.

The video of the mom who shot the intruder scared the hell out of me.  She should have NEVER had to ask the 911 operator if she was authorized to shoot an intruder.  She should have know the answer to that if she had a weapon in the house.

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Offline Thomasmagnum

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #21 on: 05 February 2012, 17:29:30 »
I can't speak for macro, but my  home defense "kit" is in a small bedside safe as well.
Here are what I consider my essentials:
 I keep two loaded pistols inside the safe(my .45 &  a .38+P revolver my wife is more comfortable shooting). I also keep two reloads for each gun. Consisting of two full magazines for the .45 and two speedloaders for the revolver. There is also a small pocket knife and a small very bright LED flashlight.  I charge my cell phone on top of the safe. Keeping a cell phone there guarantees a working phone to dial 911 in case the power gets cut off.
My safe has 5 digit code entered via an electronic keypad followed by a green light showing it as unlocked. I can access it in under 10 seconds giving me loaded pistol in hand with a phone to dial 911 with as well.
« Last Edit: 05 February 2012, 19:45:17 by Thomasmagnum »
To a liberal, a right is what others owe you.
To a conservative, a right is what others can't take away from you.
-My esteemed friend and mentor
Kenneth Edgar Howell

Offline Thomasmagnum

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #22 on: 05 February 2012, 17:39:52 »
If an intruder breaks into my house and I shoot him dead.....do I go to jail? 


Speaking rather generally here, but that is unlikely. Arizona has a law often called the castle doctrine. Essentially what that states is that if a person(s) enters your home uninvited/forcibly etc. that it is assumed that they are they with harmful intentions, and it is safe to protect yourself/loved ones with the force you deem needed. 
The burden of proof is on the "bad guy" to prove they were there intending to cause no harm. Rather difficult to do given the nature of them being there in the first place.

That said it is an excellent idea to take either a defensive handgun course or a ccw class to learn the legality of "shoot" Vs. "don't shoot" situations.
« Last Edit: 05 February 2012, 19:41:45 by Thomasmagnum »
To a liberal, a right is what others owe you.
To a conservative, a right is what others can't take away from you.
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Offline Macrojamin

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #23 on: 05 February 2012, 19:03:34 »
I have timed myself from bed to ready as about 8 seconds, this is to open the safe draw the pistol slide the mag in and rack it. I drill every now and then to keep my time under 10 seconds.
"It is not the strongest of a species that survives, nor the most intelligent. It is the one most adaptable to change, that survives."

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Offline Baddeye

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #24 on: 05 February 2012, 19:50:40 »
I have timed myself from bed to ready as about 8 seconds, this is to open the safe draw the pistol slide the mag in and rack it. I drill every now and then to keep my time under 10 seconds.

Wait, you keep your gun locked in a small safe, but unloaded?  That seems counterproductive to me.
-Jason

Offline lizaloo

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #25 on: 07 February 2012, 04:45:41 »
Kimberley,
I was raised in a house with guns. My dad was in the Air force and then a LAPD Motor Officer.  we all knew from a young age how to properly fire the weapons and to leave them alone.
We would be more than willing to take you to the firing range with us so you can see just exactly what the weapons can and can not do and how to handle them.
With you going to the homes in hidden valley and other areas of Maricopa in the early morning and evening hours it would be a good idea for you to have some protection.  I know that Caswells has a class on gun safety and also the concealed weapons classes.
There is a group of people starting a gun club in maricopa just for the kinds of questions you have.  The gun club will be discussing gun safety and rules, regulations and upcoming gun legislation and etc..........
Give us a call....
Proud Army Mom

Offline Fritzydoodle

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #26 on: 07 February 2012, 10:21:31 »
A little late to chime in but agree with what has been covered.  My kids learned to shoot early.  It was a right of passage to go dove hunting at 4 with a single shot 410.  As adults, we are all well armed if the need arises. 

While we have several handguns available, my favorite home protection weapon remains a shotgun.  A 12gauge with buckshot is very effective at close range.  Ours is in the bedroom, loaded but not chambered.  The sound of the action in the dark is enough to make a grown man wet himself in fear.

A shotgun takes more coordination to chamber a round and is more difficult to accidentally shoot yourself than a handgun, especially for a child.  Plus, the pellets don't travel far through the walls when compared to a bullet.  Less risk of striking someone in the next room or house.

Like others have said...PRACTICE...PRACTICE...PRACTICE.  You can't do it enough.
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Offline Macrojamin

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #27 on: 07 February 2012, 10:58:29 »
A little late to chime in but agree with what has been covered.  My kids learned to shoot early.  It was a right of passage to go dove hunting at 4 with a single shot 410.  As adults, we are all well armed if the need arises. 

While we have several handguns available, my favorite home protection weapon remains a shotgun.  A 12gauge with buckshot is very effective at close range.  Ours is in the bedroom, loaded but not chambered.  The sound of the action in the dark is enough to make a grown man wet himself in fear.

A shotgun takes more coordination to chamber a round and is more difficult to accidentally shoot yourself than a handgun, especially for a child.  Plus, the pellets don't travel far through the walls when compared to a bullet.  Less risk of striking someone in the next room or house.

Like others have said...PRACTICE...PRACTICE...PRACTICE.  You can't do it enough.
My two cents...

Actually buckshot is much more likely to over-penetrate than a well designed hollow point or frangible round. But I agree that a shotgun is a great defensive weapon, I however go for the 5 round follow up method of light bird shot, heavy bird shot, buck, buck, slug.
"It is not the strongest of a species that survives, nor the most intelligent. It is the one most adaptable to change, that survives."

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Offline KendoPt4

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #28 on: 07 February 2012, 11:50:50 »
Not to go too off topic but these guys do some eye-opening penetration tests (heh heh) regarding interior walls and different rounds:http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/theboxotruth.htm

Offline Thomasmagnum

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Re: Legit Question to gun owners and non-gun owners
« Reply #29 on: 07 February 2012, 12:04:50 »
There are significant pros and cons to the defense shotgun.
Especially for a novice. They require two hands to opperate making it more difficult to try to open doors or speak to 911 on the phone while armed. The added length of the weapon makes it cumbersome in tight confines such as hallways or doorways. Bird shot is known and proven to be a very poor fight stopper in countless actual gunfights. I've personally tested birdshot fired into soaked newsprint at 21ft and under(realistive defensive shooting distancts). Soaked print gives a very accurate test of bullet performance and penetration. In my test with typical light game birdshot(#5 through #9 shot size) I've seen penetration as little as 3". Compared to the normal desired 10"-12" of penetration recommend for a defensive rounds, and I'd say that is pretty unfavorable. Once you get to #4 sized shot and above you start to see some better results. With all but a few exceptions most slugs on the market will penetrate walls FAR more than any defensive pistol round and even many rifle rounds(mass in motion after all... most slugs weigh at least 1oz). 00 or 000 buck is very effective and splits the difference well between the dismal pentration of bird shot, and the massive over penetration of most slugs. Its hard to argue against 6 or 9 .36 caliber lead balls being sent at roughly 1200fps.

As to the racking of a pump shotgun being a deterrent to criminals, and striking such fear the they virtually wet themselves or go fleeing into the night... All I can point out is if the son of bitch was bold enough to enter an occupied home intent on crime(rape, murder, burglary, etc.) what makes you think that noise is going to scare him off...  and great now the bad guy nows exactly where you are when he hears you rack that pump.
To a liberal, a right is what others owe you.
To a conservative, a right is what others can't take away from you.
-My esteemed friend and mentor
Kenneth Edgar Howell